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Electronics Forum / Basics / January 2007Recommendation on embedded systems
I am considering buying a development system for chip level programming and wonder what most experts recommend to someone in my position. I have very little electronics experience other that understanding what the basic components are <supposed> to do. But I have spent a little time programming in C, as well as a entry level college coarse a few years ago, and wrote a few custom Dos utilities with it. I have done a lot of programming in dBase, and simply chose C for those few times when I needed to get a little closer to the metal. I don't plan to do enough projects for chip cost to become much of a factor, just hobby stuff that will be used in my own manufacturing business. So I have drifted away from the thought of something as complex as AVG, and am considering the C-stamp, guessing it is superior to the Basic Stamp, and more suitable to my past experience. It also seems future experience with something like the C-stamp might be more useful to graduating up to something like the AVG someday, than experience with the Basic stamp would, but just a wag. Just wondering about suggestions of the group, on these products, or any others. At this point I'm not locked in to anything. Thanks for you thoughts and taking time to write, Max Visit avrfreaks.net and look in the 'tools' area under 'dev boards' for inexpensive boards with atmel AVR cpu. >I am considering buying a development system for chip level programming and >wonder what most experts recommend to someone in my position. [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > >Max If you know C programming then I'd go with the TI msp430. I have the $20 usb programmer eZ430-F2013 Development Tool in a USB Stick http://www.ti.com/corp/docs/landing/ez430tool/index.htm You want to make a living working with these things? Then maybe you need to know which processor has most designs... not necessarily most copies shipped (like washing machines, coffee pots). The nominees are... Microchip PIC, Atmel AVR, Freescale HC12, Intel 8051s, TI MSP, please complete the list. These are not DSPs or 32 bit desktop class CPUs like ARMs and Power PCs. "The envelope please.... And the winner is..... Atmel AVR! On behalf of all the AVR programmers in the world, I'd like to accept this award and thank the embedded engineers of the world for voting for AVR as the best and fastest embedded microcontroller. Goodnight! Drive home safely!" I invite rebuttals and anecdotal evidence to the contrary. Don't buy atmel crap they are a bunch of crooks... http://www.marketwatch.com/News/Story/Story.aspx?guid=%7bC65C5E7A-2D9E-443C-8106 -882D7A541EE5%7d&siteid=yhoo&dist=yhoo > You want to make a living working with these things? Then maybe you > need to know which processor has most designs... not necessarily most [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > microcontroller. Goodnight! Drive home safely!" I invite rebuttals > and anecdotal evidence to the contrary. I won't be making my living with these things, my interest is just for a hobby. That's why I was considering the C-stamp. Considering the number of projects I intend, which will be few, I was hoping the stamp would shorten the learing curve. Would it not? And would it not be easy to tranition to AVR later if I felt inclined? > If you know C programming then I'd go with the TI msp430. I have the $20 > usb > programmer eZ430-F2013 Development Tool in a USB Stick > > http://www.ti.com/corp/docs/landing/ez430tool/index.htm What do you feel the strengths of the TI MSP430 are when compared to one of the stamps, or something like the AVR family of chips? MSP430 has 16 bit regs, so it might do certain apps needing 16 bit ops better than an AVR, which has 8 bit regs. I guess some artificial benchmark that added up lots of 8 bit numbers would run at 20 mips on a 20 mhz avr, but the same app adding up 16 bit numbers would slow down by half, and the MSP430 might actually beat it. Does the MSP430 run at 20 mhz? > MSP430 has 16 bit regs, so it might do certain apps needing 16 bit ops > better than an AVR, which has 8 bit regs. It has 3 16-bit regs. (in addition to stack poinnter and PC) but yeah 16 bit operations take 2 cycles (vs 1 for 8 bit.) > I guess some artificial > benchmark that added up lots of 8 bit numbers would run at 20 mips on a > 20 mhz avr, but the same app adding up 16 bit numbers would slow down > by half, and the MSP430 might actually beat it. Does the MSP430 run at > 20 mhz? some will do 16.  SignatureBye. Jasen >> If you know C programming then I'd go with the TI msp430. I have the $20 >> usb [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >What do you feel the strengths of the TI MSP430 are when compared to one of >the stamps, or something like the AVR family of chips? Can't compare cuz I never used a stamp. For $20 the Ez430 development kit is well worth it. It comes with a limited IAR-C compiler. If $20 is too much, then go to one of TI's free seminars. They give the development kits free to all the attendees. >>What do you feel the strengths of the TI MSP430 are when compared to one >>of [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > They > give the development kits free to all the attendees. Sounds like an excellent deal from a cost stand point, but if investing $100 to $200 for an education package will get me in to something with a shorter learing curve, I probably have to consider it worth it. So within reason, cost really isn't part of my selection criteria. Get the mega32 development board from ere.co.th for $32 >I don't plan to do enough projects for chip cost to become much of a factor, >just hobby stuff that will be used in my own manufacturing business. So I >have drifted away from the thought of something as complex as AVG, and am >considering the C-stamp, guessing it is superior to the Basic Stamp, and >more suitable to my past experience. Another thing you might look at is the Arduino. Like the Stamp, it's a common microcontroller (in this case an Atmel ATmega8) on a carrier board, plus a development environment. The Arduino's language is C with some preprocessing to make some tasks easier. SignatureWim Lewis <wiml@hhhh.org>, Seattle, WA, USA. PGP keyID 27F772C1 > I am considering buying a development system for chip level programming and > wonder what most experts recommend to someone in my position. [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Max The PIC-AXE is by far the easiest introduction, and the easiest way to get a "no-fuss" project working. You don't even need to write code if you don't want to, you can use flowcharts. PICAXE killed the BASIC Stamp's market. http://www.rev-ed.co.uk/picaxe/ http://www.picaxe.org/ Dave :) >> I am considering buying a development system for chip level programming >> and [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > > Dave :) Do they have a US distributor for their products, or would I have to order from the UK or NZ? And if so, how much expense and lead time does that add to most UPS orders? > >> I am considering buying a development system for chip level programming > >> and [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] > from the UK or NZ? And if so, how much expense and lead time does that add > to most UPS orders? From: http://www.rev-ed.co.uk/picaxe/distributors.htm Gives: http://www.world-educational-services.net/cart/ as the official US distributor. Dave :) |
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